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This is a dialogue discussing the Bill Joy article "Why the Future Doesn't Need Us..."

Allowatjc: I think Bill Joy's article " why the future doesnt need us gives a pretty good prediction dont u
Whttgr04: well, I agree with some of his points, about ethics, but I think he is overreacting
Allowatjc: I think he has a good read on the pulse of technology...
Allowatjc: he is part of it..
Whttgr04: Yes he is a part of technology but trying to make predictions about the future is impossible...
Whttgr04: No one can foresee the future
Allowatjc: You know The Times of London said the article could be compared to Einstein’s 1939 letter to the president warning about the nuclear bomb.
Allowatjc: And the fact that a scientist of his stature stood up and confronted such potential problems, proves there is most likely truth in what he says
Whttgr04: Maybe, but to me it says he is feeling guilty because his research and work might one day lead to possible disasters. He is thinking “what if” and it’s making him paranoid. Frankly, I think Joy is more concerned with the ethics of scientists and what dangers they could cause than with the actual technologies themselves. Plus you know that they say people are afraid of the unknown. Well, people don't know the future or what it holds so therefore they are afraid of it. Joy should not overreact though saying that the human race with be over thrown by robots or some kind genetically engineered creatures.
Allowatjc: true, but the only real check and balance of new technologies is the ongoing education of policymakers and the public. As Scott McNealy, CEO, Sun Microsystems has stated, "Joy has made a habit of predicting and inventing the future. Nearly 20 years before almost anyone else, he knew the world would be built around the internet. Given his track record, maybe we all need to spend more time thinking about the issues he addressed...."
Allowatjc: And Bruce Sterling, author, Distraction has said that Bill Joy is having an " I am Death, the destroyer of worlds" moment. So maybe his eyes have been opened to the monster he has helped spawn and we just can’t see it yet.
Whttgr04: Well, why worry about something that may be? People are so concerned bout the future they are blind to the present.
Allowatjc: Hmm…well I think we do need to think about could happen. Kieran Cloonan, product development analyst, Private Business has said, "will the future be more Star Trek or Blade Runner? ...both have seemed out of range...but as Ray Kurzweil is to Bill Joy, so Joy is to me, and I am forced now to throw open the book on possibility."
Allowatjc: This is all that is asked of humanity look into these possibilities and have an in-depth discussion of these very real issues.
Allowatjc: people are driven by technology...
Allowatjc: Sherry Turkle, professor of the sociology of science, MIT says that, " ...in our everyday experiences with technology that give us ' objects to think with.'...the problem is that most people arent seeing the big picture... I believe that if people were encouraged to reflect more about human uniqueness, the idea of being replaced by robots would seem more problematic."
Whttgr04: I think Joy fears what humans will do with the technology not the technology itself...Robots are not the "next big threat to mankind" as Richard Wallace, botmaster, Alice chat robot says. "Most people working in robotics...are barely scratching out a living...Our small startouts are hardly as threatening as nuclear proliferations"
Allowatjc: yes, but these people as they also stated, " the last thing we need right now is more government regulations...." these people are only concerned about making another almighty dollar.
Whttgr04: Well so is the rest of society! It is the American Dream to "make it big"...
Allowatjc: right the ‘American Dream’ is about money and materialism, but what makes it so bad in the GNR (genetics, nanotechnology, robotics) fields, is that "the scientist are so worried about if they can, they don't stop to think if they should." =-O
Allowatjc: quote from Jurassic Park
Whttgr04: I agree most heartedly with that, but, according to Michael Lyons, senior corporate counsel, US Surgical, "It seems that people look at the increasing power of computers as some kind of revolutionary force of nature that can't be stopped...computers themselves can’t 'evolve' on their own- yet. So this is not an uncontrollable 'force of nature'; it is something still within the control of human beings, and our moral and ethical concerns should guide our decisions". If this quote scares you, it should. It scares me cause I know that the morals of our country stink and I think Joy is scared because of this too. It is not the technology that will hurt us it is our ethics and how the lack of them will influence our decisions.
Allowatjc: True we do have ethical problems
Allowatjc: but if the tech becomes sentient then we will have a bigger problem
Allowatjc: we have a hard enough time teaching our children right and wrong, obviously look at all the criminals, can u image trying to teach a robot, keep it under control. Humans haven’t created anything bug free anyway.
Whttgr04: If we cannot even teach our children from right and wrong as you say, then maybe America should stop worrying about the future and worry about the present and clean up society
Allowatjc: Maybe, but then there also has to be a halt of these technologies that are rushing us into the future so blisteringly fast that no one has time to see potential  problems and say ‘maybe we shouldn’t do that’
Allowatjc: just like silicon valley has taught us if u kept moving fast enough no one has time to keep up with the problems u are creating until its to late
Whttgr04: Well, Roger Frank, a mathematics/computer science teacher at Ponderosa High School in Parker Colorado says "I've been using Joy's article in my classroom. I teach several AP classes with [bright] kids. It amazes me how...the kids just don't want to think or talk about [the issues Joy raises]"
Allowatjc: this is exactly why we must voice these concerns so that they will be forced to think about them, these are people that will so be running the place we must see to it that they think ahead
Whttgr04: In my opinion Americans are just to indifferent to society anyway, and as Joy says, society has a  "bias toward instant familiarity and unquestioning acceptance...of scientific breakthroughs" In that case, people will either not care about what happens in the future, or like all other technologies will accept them.
Allowatjc: thats a valid opinion but my point is that is discussion should be carried on, on a much larger scale, among the people that can effect can
Whttgr04: yes but look at generation x and y, nobody seems to care anymore. we should pay more attention to our kids instead of having our heads in the tv, internet or other technology
Allowatjc: my point exactly we need to talk, communicate... otherwise we are doomed
Allowatjc: Chris S. Markham, release engineer, Adobe says that venture capitalists can take the lead by asking the hard ethical questions along with the hard revenue-stream questions.
Whttgr04: yes, but don’t just talk about technology. Growing up is not an easy thing. I hated my life between the ages of 13 and 16. I would not repeat them for anything. If someone came to me and asked me about robots or genetic engineering at those ages, I would turn my back on them. Adults seem to have forgotten what it was like to be young- that or either times are just harder now- my point is though is that adults and adolescents are growing apart. Adults needs to bridge this gap through communication relevant to them, and that is not through talking about technology
Allowatjc: this maybe true, the speech should be couched toward the appropriate audience, but i think that’s an American short fall...
Allowatjc: there was a letter to the editor of wired where Joy's article was published, from schoolchildren in Italy that were girls and boys of 14 years of age.....
Allowatjc: i think this speaks of the society... its how the adult population looks at the kids... and how they except them to respond and act...
Whttgr04: how so?
Allowatjc: if the adults expected them to understand, take an active role in the discussions, and such...
Allowatjc: then the kids would grow into that mold
Allowatjc: they would full-fill those expectations
Whttgr04: These are children from Italy, naive young children, who have read only one argument on this topic. If you want them to be active in discussions then you will have to appeal to them some how, make technology interesting; however, as I mentioned before, most young adults don't care about society or technology. This is not necessarily a flaw, it's just that they have other things on their mind, other things that seem more important- like discovering who they are.
Allowatjc: i hate technology
Whttgr04: yeah me too
Whttgr04: lets burn our ‘puters
Allowatjc: ok
Whttgr04: you know what i hate the most
Allowatjc: what
Whttgr04: television!
Allowatjc: english
Allowatjc: oh
Whttgr04: its the devil
Allowatjc: true
Allowatjc: true
Whttgr04: its ALL lies
Whttgr04: ‘cept for jeopardy
Allowatjc: :-D
Whttgr04: and Bravo
Allowatjc: :-\ u know i'm not a luddite or anything, but if i were faced with a future like that portrayed by Snow Crash, i dont think that I would want to be a part of it
Whttgr04: no, me neither
Whttgr04: you know my philosophy is that humans subconsciously try to distract themselves from thinking about anything important- meaning that they would rather be sucked into their computers and DVD's and their imaginary world- why do you think that is?
Allowatjc: because alot of people arent equipped to deal with the real issues... its the same reason alot of people drink their lives away... or the reason some people never have a deep conversation... its always hi and bye and how are you ... when they really dont care... and wont stay around long enough to listen and hear the truth anyway.... most people are just plain shallow... they fill their lives with non stop action and 'stuff ' so that their mines will be to busy to realize that its an empty life
Allowatjc: >:o hey do u hear me out there.... :-(  stop and think it wont kill u
Allowatjc: but the alternative might
Whttgr04: I think it's because they haven't searched to find their purpose in life. I am still searching for mine.... Yes I agree, you think all those scientist are 'inventing' stuff to distract them?
Allowatjc: yes
Whttgr04: Hmmm
Allowatjc: well as you can see there is alot of discussion that can be had over this topic, so as Joy said I would like this subject to be discussed elsewhere in other forums. Our english teacher certainly got the message. Bill, we're talking about the problems arent we? well this me signing off, for tonight, onward and out we go carrying the word, like apostles of Joy, into the dark, uncertain future... keep babbling
Whttgr04: And keep thinking too!
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